I have seen quite-a-few post since I've been on this forum on R&P steering upgrades. This thread I've started to convey what maybe possible to make such a boneyard/DIY upgrade. Over this weekend I attended the James Dean Run car gathering near Marion, IN. abt 60 SW of Fort Wayne. I met a group there Friday 24th. who had done such a swap on a 60's Falcon and Mustang. The guys told me they used Fox Body 79-93 front clips. I was impressed w/ what I saw. When u change the clip u get the brakes, R&P and everything else that makes the handling come into this century. My only regret is that I did'nt get more info from these guys - they were very friendly. I was hopin to see them on Saturday but they did'nt return. I looked high and low for them - no luck. I don't have the advanced skills, equipment or space to do something like this but there are lots of folks on this medium that cud pull it off - No doubt in my mind from some of the stuff I've seen here. Anyway, I have some pic's of the Falcon The owners agree that it made a huge difference in the handling of our cars. For those who may be interested might want to check out the Falcon forums/sites. Sorry I did'nt get more info. Lastly I met another 73 Comet owner at the J Dean. He had a very nice car he say's he picked up in Chicago. He lives in Ohio. His screen name is Comet289.
fwiw Ive tossed this swap around in my head a few times, Ive got a sn95 clip to use in mine one day the frame rails are within a 1/2 in width of the stock maverick rails overall (1/4 each side)
I have pondered at the thought of modifying a Fox body or SN95 k-member and bolting it to the stock rails on mine. If I could get one cheap enough that I could toss it if I buggered it up I might try it.
it shouldnt be hard to get a stock k-member and stock controle arms. they are replaced frequently for the aftermarket tubular ones. my concern about doing this is if it increases the with of the front end and also the shock towers would need some extensive modifications.
The folks who did this swap told me they put clip just rear of the shock towers. If u look at the top of the Falcon towers u can possibly see they have been shaved and modified. As I say; I was impressed w/ what they accomplished. Sorry I did'nt get more pic's and info. The GM guys seem to be able to make the GM clips/frames work on all kinds of cars - I don't think they have a lot of more tech savy than the Ford community. But, I have to respect them for makin those clips work on almost anything u can concieve. I have to give credit where it's due --- PERIOD. My brother has a 51 Buick Special w/ 69 Camaro front clip - the car as been all over the Midwest. I don't have any idea of the many many folks whom I have talked to over the years who have used Camaro, Chevelle, Monte Carlo and just abt any GM chassis u can think of and made them work. I won't say they all wud meet my safety standard as far as workmanship is concerned but I attribute that to skill level, work ethic, knowledge and most other factors in obtaining respectable end product. As I stated in beginning, this kind of mod is above me. Even if I wanted to try something I wud have to get another car - My car is in to gud a shape for me to try something of this level with my experience, equipment and work-area. I will have to make due w/ stock new replacement parts. The workmanship on these cars 60's Falcon and Stang was so nice I had to look more than once to tell it was not a factory installation. Hoping someone here will pull-it-off for others to benefit. I am sure anyone w/ the skills to make it happen wud end up w/ a big grin everytime they drove the car.
the camaro front "clip" is a whole sub frame assembly that bolts to the body with four bolts. this makes it really easy to remove and stick under anything. all the suspension stearing brakes, motor and trans mounts are all part of it. fords front "clip" is all part of the unibody structure. it would require cuting and welding for both the doner mustang and the maverick. its not impossible but it is alot biger endever than using the gm front clip.
When you do a front clip swap like that you need to get the clip from a car that has a wheel base that is very close to your project car. The track should also be very close. Then you measure back from the centerline of the front axle on your project car to a good mounting point. Check the distance between the rails and do the same on the donor car. When you find a spot that is good on both cars you cut the clip from the donor car a bit long and the one from your project a bit short. (this distance should allow you to make a staggered or step cut in both rail sections so you have an overlapping step cut of at least 1 1/2 times the height of the frame rails) Then you have to measure to maintain axle position and suspension height. Fit the cut pieces together and tack in place. measure and straighten both sides - up, down and sideways. Finish welding and place plates over the side welds and the top and bottom welds. (they should be in different places on the rails) Place doubler plates over the reinforcing plates and weld them in (top and bottom for the side plates and sides of the plates for the top plates). This will not add stress risers where the frame can fracture. If it is done properly it will form a strong connection and the steering geometry will be correct. If the front clip is from a car with a longer or shorter wheelbase then the steering will be messed up. If the track is wider or shorter then control becomes problematic or very lazy steering will result. A frame rack is very usefull (as in necessary) in getting the front clip in place to weld and to check and straighten it after tacking in place. This is a poor project for the backyard mechanic as the results can be very dangerous - like losing your front end at 70 mph going down a crowded freeway. This kind of project is best left to competent professionals with the proper equipment to do it right. This warning does not mean it can't be done by a competent welder in a home garage situation but I wanted to point out that it is more complex than just cutting and welding.
Hey Paul, I see where ur coming from. I agree this is a project for someone who is competent an has a lot of experience in frame modification. I certainly don't have the knowledge on this kind of issue to say what will or won't work. I don't know what the measurement ratios between Fox chassiss compared to other Ford cars of the era but these folks seem to have made it work. I did'nt get the chance to inquire as to wheter these guys were prof. in the auto industry or just what there status in life might be. From our conversation they seem to have been a group of gearheads or club members of whom or all may be in the auto industry in some form or fashion. Whatever the case, I was most impressed w/ the work they had accomplished and wud most likely buy either car if they were for sale and I had the money.
Ok Bryant, the Camaro is bolt on sub. What about Chevelle's and Monte Carlos? I do believe they were full box frames and I have seen them used also on cars that were far from being what is now know as Rat Rods. I wud think these clips wud also have to be cut and welded on donor and receiving cars unless u were using entire frames. I am not in the auto industry and never have been, I am just going from what I have basically seen other accomplish over the years. I suppose doing the swap w./ the unibody structures are much more involved that's why u hardly if ever see them used. This is the first time I have seen it done and don't know what it wud take to do it on our cars. After seeing these cars - I wud be the last to say it can't be done.
if you look at a camaro sub frame and a chevelle frame the front sections are really similar up to the fire wall. you can put any thing on to any thing. its just easyer with some things than others.
There are a few important considerations when selecting a front clip. Most important are the wheelbase and track. The wheelbase (length from the center of the rear axle to the centerline of the front axle) is the most important because the angle of the steering arm on the spindles is dependent on that dimension along with the track (width of the front axle). If there is more than an inch or two difference you are in for some re-engineering to eliminate bump steer and to maintain your turn radius.
