I know this has been covered before in the forum, but my buddy is very adamant about trying to use the zbar set up w/the factory 1989 5.0 & headers. Actually the zbar he has is the 1 piece 6 cyll variety. He already has stock clutch pedal assy & a mav bell housing & a spacer-that is it. This is to be a conversion from column shift auto to the t5 setup. I've told him about the cable or hydrualic clutch route, givin him alot of print-outs from all the forum members which he thinks is cool, but he really is a miser w/$ so he has a lot of misc parts & likes to fab things from other fords. Is anyone using a zbar setup w/a 5.0??? Thanks...
You can with the right parts but...The late model 302 block does not have the boss on the block for the pivot ball (which you gotta have to use the Z bar set up) Pivot ball Adapters are available through various mustang parts houses like NPD. He will most likely have better luck useing an older mustang Z bar setup than the I-6 parts. A Cable or hydraulic set up is best...Especially if he plans to use headers.
If he has the T5 and the T5 bell I think the cheapest route is the Mustang steve cable kit. Even if he as the mav bell, then the T5 to early bell adapter, he still needs to buy the pivot ball mount for the block as mentioned, and the correct Z-bar (which isnt cheap). The Mustang Steve kit is like $200 and you are done and you arent spending days fabbing stuff. After driving my Mav with the hydraulic setup I hate driving my Mustang with the cable. it worlds apart. Its odd having a nicer smoother clutch in the old car then what is in the newer one.
Ryan; what kit did you use, or what parts did you use to complete your hydraulic setup? I am thinking about going hydraulic, but have no idea where to start with parts. Thanks, Earl
The only way he can use the old z bar setup with a 5.0 and a T5 is if he uses an old bell housing like a toploader bell housing with an adaptor too the T5. As mentioned there is the pivot ball that is on the side of the block on the 302's that is not on the 5.0 engines. But the clutch is also actuated differently, also a different style of clutch is run between the two setups... I know some of this is a little redundant and I know he has the bellhousing and spacer already but I figured I would go with it to explain a little better. The 302 clutch is the old borg and beck style clutch, the pivot ball in the bell housing is in the center of the release lever and to actuate the clutch the arm has to be pushed towards the rear of the car. On the 5.0/T5 the clutch used is the diaphram style, but it gets even more confusing with that. You would think that you would just be able to transplant the borg and beck clutch onto the diaphram flywheel... wrong the 5.0 diaphram clutches are....Metric .... and the borg and beck(3 finger style) are SAE...See there are these alignment pins that are either SAE or metric depending on the flywheel and unless you get a conversion clutch or a conversion flywheel if you just stick a the other type of clutch on the flywheel it is known to chew up a brand new clutch pretty quickly... But anyways back to what I was saying the 5.0/T5 clutches the pivot ball for the clutch release lever(or fork depending on who you talk too) is on the end of the clutch release lever, this requires the clutch lever to be pushed/or pulled too the front of the car. And then is he aware that the Z-bar limits what he can put in the car? You know like some headers wont work with the z-bar(noticed he had headers already), the power steering setup in my car wont work with the z-bar and soo on and soo forth. But just for the short list for him to get the z-bar setup to work with a 5.0.. Flywheel that will accept the borg and beck clutch bellhousing that will accept the pivot ball in the correct location engine block off plate to match the bell housing clutch release fork/lever bell housing to T5 adaptor clutch and throwout bearing and the 2 peice z-bar (which are prone to failure) there are several people(myself included that have done the hydraulic setup on the T5 style bellhousing using an external slave cylinder that works just awesome and is allot cleaner then the mess of linkage...and in almost the year of daily driving my car I have not had to adjust my hydraulic clutch once...)
try rosehill they were some awesome guys to work with and their kits are priced decent too http://rosehillperformanceparts.com/
Considering the same thing down the road.(for now I finally have it working reliably) I would like to get a parts list together though. BTW: for the OP, The Zbar idea might work on the cheap if you had a 302 Zbar to begin with. Adapting a 6 cyl one is just asking for a good old fashioned butt whipping. BUT, not impossible so weld away if you desire. Markso125 makes very valid points on a few of the potential headaches.JMHO
Actually, the old Ford clutches are Long-style, Borg & Beck had shorter fingers. On mine I'm using an old bellhousing (Lakewood) with a T5 adaptor plate, 66 mustang z-bar, z-bar block adaptor. I drilled the 5.0 flywheel to accept the old pressure plate bolt pattern. CenterForce make a diaphram clutch with the old bolt pattern and a special length release bearing to work with the old bellhousing and fork. Decades ago I ran a stock 5.0 diaphram clutch assembly, which is shorter and had to put a spacer block under the release fork pivot to move the fork closer to the clutch. It worked but the CenterForce setup is so much nicer.
Let me get this straight...so basically other then correcting me about the borg and beck versus the long finger clutch(I explained it that way since it is easier too look up borg and beck instead of ford 3 finger clutch setup for a reference..that and most parts store guys would call it a borg and beck because they dont know any better...)... but anyways bact to the topic on hand....basically arent you just saying exactly everything I said?
I wasn't giving instructions or a seven paragraph disertation, just relating what I have used and done personally since my setup seems pretty close to what the OP's friend wants to do.
Thanks to all for the replys. I printed out all the posts about this conversion & will forward them to my buddy. The Mustang Steve Kit looks very simply & he would be DONE! No crazy fabbing of sorts, nothing wrong w/fabbing but this kit would speed things along bigtime!
