Yeah, if using a manual tranny behind that engine, the 9" is the way to go. I have not found the 8" to be suitable for even a decent 302 with a 4 speed. Dave
You could really be different and do a hot 6 banger! Heck, Ak Miller got a 200 into the 16's I think with late 60's tech. Hotrod Mag did a whole story on it. Now a days you should be able to scream into the 14's. No shock tower cutting, no welding. Dare to be different............ Ok guys lets see what I sturred up now......... 6 in a row, makes 'em go!
I just want to see one fuel injected and turboed with the new aluminum head comeing out... 6 in a row makes my daily driver go just fine. But I'd be lieing if I said haven't been thinking more and more about a 302 lately, and I've got two 302's either of which could go in anytime... I dunno, I'm just getting kindn of burnt out on the straight 6's and their exaust manifold problems. The exaust on mine requires constant attention it seems. Been thinking about doing a more modern V6. 3.0 Vulcan sure would be a good fit. or a newer 3.8.
What an absolute bunch of weenies. "You'll break too much stuff.........you won't be consistent.......you don't need a Cleveland.....engine compartment is too flimsy..." How about this...instead of telling him how he CAN'T or he SHOULDN'T do this or that why not answer his original questions on how he can get this done?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! I ran a four speed car in brackets for four years. Finished in the top five in No Electronics/Foot Brake class three out of those four years. And I didn't break a damned thing either. Build it right the first time and go race. Ok...you're going to build a bracket car so I presume you'll be doing a roll bar/roll cage. A good eight point bar should be sufficient. You might want to utilize a roll cage and tie the front of the cage to the front shock towers by running two bars through the firewall into the engine compartment. Naturally, you'll have subframe connectors. I would use a tubular transmission crossmember instead of any kind of factory transmission crossmember. Also, instead of using the bolt-in style driveshaft loops you should run two tubular, weld-in driveshaft loops. This will add lateral stiffness to the chassis. Cal Trac bars with leaf springs and QA-1 or Strange Engineering shocks should work fine. Motor plates are a good idea. However, mounting the mid-plate (the plate between the engine and the transmission) will be a royal pain in the butt with a Maverick engine compartment. If you're a good craftsman you can do it. Here is a mid-plate pic..... ......and a motor plate pic........... Attach these to the frame with tabs. Ties the chassis together. These are pics from Skinny Kid Race Cars. You could simply use motor mounts for an easier setup but you'll need to use some type of "torque strap" running from the left side frame rail to the engine. This will prevent twisting in the front of the chassis. I'd go ahead and get a nine inch rear just for peace of mind. 33 or 35 spline axles with a steel spool. Also get a good driveshaft with forged yokes at the front and rear. Use the 1350 series U-Joints. For your transmission.......I've got one word for you: Jerico. Don't bother with any pro shifted stock toploader boxes or any of those wimpy-assed Tremec transmissions. Get a Jerico and be done with it. You won't break it and you won't miss a gear either. Here's how you avoid using the factory z-bar for the clutch linkage: Wolfe Racecraft clutch pedal kit. This will get the z-bar out of the way of the headers too. I'd use a Long Vertigate shifter so you don't miss. Here's a link to the G-Force site where you can see the shifters: http://www.g-forcetransmissions.com/ On your Cleveland.....I've had good success with stock cranks and rods when they're properly prepped. However, with the prices of today's stroker kits I'd be hard pressed NOT to build a 393" Cleveland with four barrel heads. The heads feed better with an engine that is at or near 400". Plus, you get a really good rotating assembly. Use ARP studs in the mains, standard volume oil pump, Moroso pan, and an MPG windage tray. Camshafts....pick your roller. Comp Cams, Crane, Cam Motion, etc. I'm fond of Comp Cams # 32-680-9. .702"/.702", 258/262 @ .050", 104 centerline. Lots of lift and decent on duration so it's not a valve spring killer. What else......oh yeah, when you order the windage tray from MPG you should also order their Port Plates for the four barrel heads. http://www.mpgheads.com/ Ok....intake: Edelbrock Torker or one of the Ford Racing intakes designed for the Yates heads. I can find a part number that I've used in the past on one of these that will work. Carb.....Holley 950HP. Ignition: MSD billet distributor. Clutch: Ram or McLeod. I can suggest a couple of part numbers for the clutch/pressure plate setups if you want. I've done this deal before. People told me the same thing all these guys are telling you. Told me it would be easier to go with an automatic and a Windsor. I don't do "easy". I choose to do things that people say can't or shouldn't be done because it's so damned much fun proving them wrong. Let me know if you need some help.
ShadowMaster, Thanks so much for your vote of confidence!! I will most likely be PMing you in the not to distant future for help on my motor and trans setup. Thanks again man!! -Andrew
I agree with shadowmaster. If you listen to what everyone says on the 'net, then you'll never get the car together. You'll be buying parts, then someone says they won't work, and you'll buy more....and it just snowballs from there. How many people out there have just bought a bunch of stuff, put it all together, and went out for a win the first time out? Not many. Most of us have spent years...even decades--to get to where we are now. Some of us are still learning and experimenting with different things. Best suggestion, quit listening to what everyone says and just build what YOU want and go race it! If you want to be SERIOUS about winning in bracket racing, I suggest you go buy a pre-built dragster for around $100K and go win some races. At least you'll start with a consistent car. If you want to HAVE FUN (which is what it's all about anyway) in bracket racing, read on...... BTW, I know of a guy that had a '68 Mustang fastback...4 speed Jerico with a 408 windsor putting out around 550 HP or so. Runs 6.40's in the 1/8 and is VERY consistent...and the guy can flat cut a light too. In the years I've raced, I always hated running him cause he was always on the dial and choppin' the tree. It is very possible to have a good consistent 4-5-6 speed car but it takes a lot of work, experience, and a pile of broken parts to get the consistency it takes to win. Once you get there (whether you're running 15 seconds with a 250 6 cylinder or 8's with a big block) you'll have the satisfaction of knowing that you put a lot of supposedly more consistent automatic-trans cars on the trailer. Believe me, it feels pretty darn good to accomplish that. First time I ever bracket raced with a stick was with my old 5 speed 84 Mustang. Went to the finals where I put myself out with a 489 red, but it was awesome to kick some automatic booty....not only that, but it was also more exciting during the run because I was hammering gears and chirping tires through 4th. It was probably more fun with that car than my Maverick was at that time (powerglide and 351w...running 6.80's). But the mustang broke a lot of parts....clutch, rear ends, u-joints, engine mounts, etc. Answer your question about motor plates: I am running both a front motor plate and a mid plate. Mid plate sandwiches between the trans and engine and the front plate sandwiches between the water pump and timing cover. They are super easy to deal with. A lot easier than messing with the stock mounts were. I can also pull the trans if needed without touching the motor plates...just unbolt it and pull it out, the plates will keep the motor steady in the frame. The only downside to them is that there is NO vibration isolation. You will feel the motor in the driver's seat...which is not necessarily a bad thing unless it's a street car. That would get old after while. Plates will also allow the engine to become part of the frame (called a stressed member) which stiffens up the chassis slightly. I included a picture of mine. You can't see the mid plate back there but it's in there...in fact, at the time the picture was taken, there was no transmission crossmember in there. The trans was just hanging off the back with no support. I have since built & installed one for peace of mind and to help stiffen things up a little.
yeah when I first read your reply I was more than a little pissed I wrote several bad words included comments about "you doing things the hard way" and "rental cars" and "championships". but I decided to leave it out of the post....figured it wasn't neccessary
John that is saying something. Not trying to take away from Shadow masters World Championship thingy. But I bet I could "easily" rent a car and race it to. How hard is that Kind of contraditing from somebody who supposedly does things the hard way. Not trying to bust your balls SM just an observation . I say we all rent Cars and go racin. I get the Tauras. :evilsmile HOwever I digress I have no "World Championships" of my own and may be a tad Jeolous.
here is the plate system on PINKY. Even though this topc got a little "off" Good luck with your project and definitely keep us updated on how its going!
