Having a Brake issue with an 85 E-150

Yeah the Saturn is like that too, I can't say as i've ever tried to make a brake turn though. Worst thing I ever did with it was take a cloverleaf freeway onramp at 50 .
Was having one of those days..

 

I got a chance to fiddle with it some more today. I measured the rear hose with my plastic caliper tool before and while the brake was being applied (using my toolbox again). Both times the measurement was the same so the hose was not changing shape or size and it doesn't appear to have any abrasions on it.

After all that was said and done I took it for a spin, the brake light came on a couple times but quickly went off. As I was backing down my driveway (it's on a slight slope) I hit the brakes real fast I heard the front lock and the front tires skid but the back didn't lock. Slowly releasing the pedal I could hear the back brakes disengaging (was still in the driveway) so they are working just not as well as they should be, either that or something else is screwing with it. Only thing left to look at now would be those wheel cylinders and of course the Adjustments which i'll check once I check the wheel cylinders.

I also still notice fluid seapage on the MC in the front of it around the Secondary Reservoir. Again it is happening when I move the van and hit the brakes repeatedly. I tried using the cover and gasket off the old MC as they are still in good shape but that didn't help. The Primary Reservoir is fine no seapage on that side and the Primary Reservoir Fluid level remains constant, so something keeps making the secondary one overflow a bit .

If everything in the back checks out WC's, adjustment, etc then the only thing left would be the Proportioning Valve in which case I would be screwed .

 

Throwing all my chips in on the adjustment

 

Did you bench bleed the M/C or bleed it on the van??? If you bled it on the van you may have damaged it.Allways bench bleed a M/C before installing it.When you do it on the vehicle there is too much pedal stroke for a dry M/C.What happens is the piston in the M/C goes over center(for lack of a better term) and damages the seal for the rear brakes causing the problem you have.The compensating port in the M/C also get damaged when this happens causing low peadal and or peadal fade.Make sure the adjustment is up to par as blue has stated before you go throwing money at it.Good luck.

 

Yes, this is another possibility...

 

I bled it on the Van, didn't have much choice as I do not have a bench vise, and the little tiny workbench that is out there (it's more of a small shelf then anything too flimsy to support a heavy bench vise) is where all my automotive chemicals are kept. The closest thing I could have done was bleed it on the Garage Floor either having someone hold it or bracing it myself (really difficult though I am a heavy guy so not impossible) and using a screwdriver or wooden dowl if I had one to actuate the Pistons. Bleeding it on the Van was easier and as for the pedal travel I did not apply much to it when I was bleeding the MC. When I did the MC in the Maverick I bled it the same way (on the vehicle) and it turned out fine, though with the Mav I didn't have a Brake Booster to worry about. I hope I didn't damage it but it wasn't that expensive if I did we're talkin like $30 here and that was for a new one re manufactured ones are like half that (This is Kragen prices). I don't like to throw money away I'm usually a stickler about it, infact i've been called Scrooge because I can be a bit of a tightwad. I'm not too worried about the MC right now though, if it turns out I did damage it then i'll cuss and throw things later . Maybe I can return it and say it was defective only I didn't realize it right away, or at least exchange it for another one and try again.

I probably could have purchased a Master Cylinder Rebuild Kit for the old one and just replaced the Pistons and Seals in it but the price difference is negligable and the new and reman ones come with those bleeder plugs (although I found out the hard way they strip easily, cheap plastic).

So far $$$ hasn't been too big of an issue everything has been reasonably cheap. I know a shop would be charging me out the ying yang for this. That Brake Job at Sears Automotive in which they only replaced the Pads in front , Shoes in Back, new drums and resurfaced rotors was $1500. At the time I didn't have any say (parents didn't want me to do it) so it wasn't my idea. They claim they also replaced the Ball Joints and realigned it (yeah right thats why the front tires cupped really bad), they didn't. To top things all off now it's making a horrible creaking and moaning noise when making slow turns like in a small parking lot. At first I thought it was the Rear End I'm thinkin oh great thats the next problem I get to deal with that was until I noticed it only does it while turning. Guess I better check the tie rods .

Oh and speaking of tires I don't know if this would effect it or not but we did just get four new tires for it back in December. They're BF Goodrich All Terrain T/A's they were on sale, I often get asked if the Van is a Four Wheel Drive variant because of the tires. I wish..

 

If the tires are alot larger diameter than the originals then I would say the potential exists for more leverage from the larger tires requireing more brake effort to stop the van.As for the creaking,probably a dry ball joint or tie rod end.I have had ranger pickups creak like a door in a haunted house and discovered that the inner tie rod ends were the culprit but that is a steering rack set up.You may have damaged the M/C in the van.I would check to make sure all components are in proper working order.If all checks out,try bleeding the system again.If you have no improvement after the second go-round.Get another M/C and bleed it off the van.(I understand your predicament) but theres alot of stroke length in the peadal and booster.When you bench bleed the M/C only pump it about 1/2 to 3/4ths of an inch of stroke untill you feel hydraulic resistance to your efforts.At that point you can put a bit more stroke to it to finish the bleeding process.good luck I hope a re-bleed does it for you.
Pete.

 

Finally Some Progress

Well I went another round with it and it looks like I may have slayed the beast finally .

I bought a re manufactured MC from AutoZone which I should have done in the first place, bled it off the Van since I do not have a bench I had to get creative. I used my shelf/workbench cleared off some of the chemicals, got a piece of an old wooden fencepost (luckily we just had our fence fixed from all the storm damage back in January) cut it so that the piece I wanted to use was slightly longer then the Master Cylinder I then braced it against the MC using a large C-Clamp, got another smaller piece of wood for the C-Clamp crank to rest on and between the two it kept the MC level so it wouldn't tip over when I tried to bleed it. Then I used one of my brake spring tools to actuate the pistons. The AutoZone MC came with an old fashioned MC Bleeder Kit (with the hoses that go into the reservoir).

Got all the air out of it and installed it on the Van. I also went ahead and replaced the Rear Brake Hose even though I said it seemed to be fine, something about it just kept bugging me. It was nothing short of a pain in the a$$, thankfully the ol blowtorch still has some gas in it, that fitting where it meets the Hose was rusted on there so bad it was like it was welded together.

When all was said and done I bled all the lines and the process went alot smoother then before dunno why I had trouble last time guess something must of messed up somewhere cause everything went together fine this time around.

Oh and I know blugene will wanna know , I made sure the adjustment was fine, infact I did that before I changed the Brake Hose, because I wanted to see if the WC Pistons were seized and I'm happy to say they were not...

Took it for a test drive and it the pedal feel seemed to be normal and no brake light (except of course when I put on the Parking Brake which is the only time I wanna see it ). It seemed to stop without any problems during the short drive around the block. time will tell if this repair job holds up .

 

Sounds great! Glad you finaly got it, i'm getting worn out over here .

 

I was beginning to wonder myself...glad you have it sorted out now.
Alls well that ends well...and stops well.
pete.

 

Well *Fingers Crossed* here's hoping.

The true test will come tomorrow when we have to go downtown, and we need the Van because we're all going that means taking my brother. Just gotta take it slow for awhile.


If all is well my next trick will be to get the Maverick running again it has a Carburetor issue (likes to dump gas) so i'm going to try a rebuild on that front so I can actually move it (right now it's stuck in the driveway), but thats for a future thread .

Thanks for the advise everyone..