Going to go help my BIL tonight after work, he replaced a motor in it with a known good one. It was really low on compression but still running when drove it into the shop. Replaced motor and now wont start. Scanner showing a p1391. It almost sounds like when cranking the timing is off, but he also took it apart and verified it is still in time, but says chain seems to have extra slack. Well I am one of them need to see it for myself before I know for sure so going to take the timing cover back off and look at it myself to verify and try and just get him to replace the dang chains while off. Any other advice or things to look for that may be causing this no start situation? Sensors were all good this weekend when driving it in shop, I can't see it going out like that.
is it a 4.7L? they are known for oil sludge and timing chain issues. my recommendation is check the crank sensor, alot of times they get knocked in the process and will cause an issue, make sure to line it up and try it again. Or could be cam sensor, not exactly sure on that engine. I ran into an issue similar to that on a 4.0 jeep once. oh, and double check all your ground wires.
Sorry yes a 4.7 Its a remanned long block, with the OLD timing chain setup. (I know, I know, trust me NOT the way I would have done it) Swapped crank shaft sensors last night no change. COULD be a cam sensor I just hate throwing new parts at things. Very well could be a ground, any clues on which grounds located where control that curcuit? Can something worn in the timing chain area make it throw a 1391 AND create a no start situation? Only thing I can think of to do that would be timing incorrect between the cams and crank.
EDIT: going to put this here for my future reference http://arrc.epnet.com/autoapp/9355JEE/9355JEE03_Timing_Chain__Sprockets__Front.htm
what kind of Reman engine did you get that had a old timing chain on it? the ones we sell have new ones installed..... not sure where all the grounds are, but when you find them, make sure you have good connections and if going to a painted surface, use one of them toothed washers to bite through the paint. Also you may want to make sure the year of the engine, 99-mid 2002 they use a 16 tooth tone wheel on the crank, somtime in mid 2002 they went to a 32 tooth tone wheel. I know that they either won't run, or won't run right if you mismatch. if your ECM has 3 plugs going into to it, then you have a 16 tooth tone wheel setup, but if it has 4, then your truck is setup for a 32 tooth tone wheel on the crank.
I have no clue where he got it from, not a very good place I assume. I wondered the same thing when he told me "long block" but then was changing timing chain stuff. Tone wheel, this is good info here. I guess I am going to have to count plugs on ECM and then manually count the teeth on the tone ring to compare. HUGE help thanks!
Jtec controller or NGC controller. Jtec 3 plugs. NGC 4 plugs. Seen it happen many times with engine swaps. Used and remans. Not a good scenario if thats what the issue is. Means your changing the engine again. Check with the supplier and verify its for your controller. 4.7 crank tone wheel is on the crankshaft internal.
I had text him earlier about the tone wheel, he swears he looked (remembers looking at it for sure) and they looked exactly the same. But I will double check myself this eavening. I'm starting to think he may have just not set up the timing right. He procedure on the phone just does not sound right to me. And he put the phone by the engine last night while trying to start it and it just don't sound right. Reminds me of my old ford probe when I slipped a timing belt. Just sounds odd while trying to crank over.
I hope not. They are a zero clearance engine. Torque the heads on with the crank/cams in the wrong place or get the chain wrong and its hit valves.
Yeah I was worried about that too. Not sure if they were intereference engines or not. Thanks for clarifying. I just need to get my eyes and hands on it, I sometimes hate trying to diagnose what someone else has worked on over the phone.
OK went through it last night......... Verified timing is correct verified 3 plug ECU verified 16 tooth tone ring verified cam sensor tone wheel in good shape not bent or odd shaped tabs Without removing all all grounds the grounds seem good tight and connected Code p1391 is no longer a hard code just a "pending code" (for 25 bucks just replaced the cam sensor) Still no start I did not bring my fuel pressure gauge so going to look at that tonight as well as compression tester. Compression seems good during hand cranking though, I know not a full out test will verify tonight. Going to verify spark, compression, and fuel delivery tonight and hope one of the easy ones is missing LOL Couple quick questions....... Any explanation on jumping fuel pump if necesarry? Whats the proper fuel pressure? How vacuum dependant are these motors? For example the mazda 2.5 liter if the o-ring in the oil dipstick tube is bad it will idle rough. If you pull out dipstick while running it will shut off. Are these motors that vacuum dependant? Timing chaing hydraulic tensioners............. How much pressure are these suppose to have? I am used to self contained tensioners that if you can push them in with your own weight and not a press its bad. These ones with the oil fed off the oil pump how much pressure should the have when oil pump not running? Kinda a odd set up to me :-/
