who all is still running drum brakes up front?

I put 1000 trouble-free miles on my original drum brake set-up last fall. The plan is to upgrade to 5-lug discs at all four corners next winter... well before the V8 install. I don't drive fast, and I always give myself lots of extra distance.

 

Compared to what?? 'Sorry, but that statement is just foolish, since it is a known fact that disc brakes are superior. If drums were so "just fine", auto manufacturers never would have switched to disc, especially since drums would cost them less.

 

Tell it to this guy
http://community.cartalk.com/discussion/2292415/the-underappreciated-drum-brake

 

Well this is total BS, drive through deep water and tell me how good your drum brakes are compared to disc that will recover far more quickly... I've driven both(my first five or so vehicles had drums) and the chance I'll recommend drum over disc is zero & none...

 

Honestly, I don't know how this is even a "debate". It's like people will lie to themselves to avoid having to spend the money on a better braking system for their old cars, risking safety to save a buck.

 

I'm not lying to myself...I got 4-wheel disc brakes on my Maverick. All I'm saying is drum brakes on a car will still slow/stop a car. Detroit made billions of cars with drum brakes. Some people think because all newer cars have disc...then old cars with drums won't stop a car. If that is the case then we need to all swap over to fuel injection and ditch our carburetor because new cars don't have carburetors and then we all need to get a cup holder while we're at it.

 

I don't think anyone here is saying that drums are superior to discs and I also agree completely. Just like saying that anyone buying a 4 cylinder when they could have a V6.. or V8.. is silly.

As far as safety is concerned.. maybe we can even go one step further and talk about buying an "economy car" with crappier anti-lock brakes and smaller rotors, compared to a luxery model with big brakes and anti-lock setup that pulses so many times per second that you can't even feel the pulses much less the "skid.. stop.. skid.. stop" anti-lock modules actuation. Ever drive a BMW or Mercedes and compare its brakes to a Chevy Malibu with 4-wheel discs? The cheap car feels like driving a U-Haul truck after comparing the two. And anyone who's ever driven a U-Haul or Ryder truck in the snow knows what I'm talking about. lol

I will say this to embelish on the real comparisons though. Anyone who knows much about brake design and their engineering principles will tell you this to be fact with most typical designs. In looking at disk vs drum brakes, one thing to keep in mind is that drum brakes can be just as effective in a stop as disks. If the drum brakes are large enough to offer the same amount of braking as the disks, a stop from a lower speed will take the same distance as with disks. The key is keeping the drum from getting too hot.

In fact.. drum brakes can often have better initial bite(brake torque) than most but the largest disc brake designs due to pad size and more importantly.. SWEPT AREA.. which are higher than most stock disc setups. Also consider that drums build heat considerably faster than discs do during initial brake application which inevitably improves initial bite that much more due to the optimum temperatures that brake lining materials are designed to work at in the first place. This is why many tests through the years show a cold drum brake can beat a cold disc brake in 30 - 0 tests.

Obviously from there.. discs spank a drum brake after heat has built up and especially as speeds increase. And repeated hard stops without sufficient cooling periods in between.. especially at high speeds.. will make drum brakes go away almost completely and feel like they've been greased.

I've known many who have crashed and even lost life from pushing an inferior system too far(on the other hand.. the same could also be said about cars without anti-lock braking too). Hell.. I almost side swiped an little old lady in a Nova while I was street racing many years ago. I was young and foolish for being pulled into that race with sub-par drum braking even though my drivetrain was more than sufficient to beat the other cars and quickly learned my lesson from the ordeal. ALWAYS drive within the vehicles limits and ALWAYS leave yourself an out. No doubt about it though.. disc brakes give you a MUCH LARGER OUT.. racing or otherwise.

 

I prefer drums on the rear due to the minimal maintenance required, but on the front they are completely inadequate and dangerous, that's all there is to it. Especially in the rain. I drove 35,000 miles with 4 wheel drums before switching over to discs. These were totally rebuilt with all new hardware, wheel cylinders, etc. They would always pull to one side or the other no matter what, and I was lucky to get 12-15,000 miles out of a set of shoes on the front. God forbid if you needed to make a panic stop or traffic slowed quickly on the interstate. Discs were the best upgrade I've ever made to my car, period. Drum brakes on a passenger car are completely inadequate to be on the road with most of today's cars having 4 wheel discs.

 

One of the few things I forgot to mention above.. thanks for making that very valid point.

Ever drive a car with leaking wheel cylinders or non-functional brakes on one end of the car? Take the blinders off.. allow extra room in front of you.. and pay extra attention. lol

Driving a car with drum brakes up front is kinda scary going down the interstate in 70 mph bumper to bumper traffic. You'd surely want to be one of those folks allowing that extra bit of room in front of you "just in case".

 

A lot depends on where and how one drives as well. Someone who mainly drives on open roads with little traffic and very conservatively will likely never truly "need" a disc brake conversion with the costs involved. Driving in the traffic I do made my decision to swap very easy because of the morons around you more than any other single cause. Being consistently cut off because I leave sufficient room to stop without undue wear and tear or riding someone's behind is more than enough reason to upgrade since 3 hard stops in summer traffic was enough to fade the drum brake system to being virtually inoperative. I have always driven old cars, most originally equipped with drums and my inclination is to switch to the best setup possible with reasonable costs unless you're driving a show car occasionally and conservatively.

For the record, a cold disc brake without a splash shield doesn't have any better initial grab than a wet drum in the rain but is more controllable when the heating and drying occurs. My experience is that the drum grabs fairly hard at the moment it does dry and you better be ready for it. A little familiarity is all it takes if you're competent behind the wheel and respectful of the nature of what you're driving.

 

Nothing like going down that big steep hill fully laid on the brake pedal, and still rolling through the stop sign... Been there lol

Hello stop sign
Bye bye stop sign

I'll stop next time

 

Pad/Shoe material also makes a big difference in stopping. The BIG mile warranty replacement parts are made with a harder material and will take longer to wear out because it's not grabbing hard enough, acts like metal on metal. I bought a new 96 Eclipes that was a blast to panic stop. No telling how many G's your body goes through. It seem like I could stop from a 100 mph roll in 75 feet. When I replaced the pads with store bought replacements it took all the fun out of panic stops. Stopping distance seem like it doubled.

 

Mine’s a daily commuter and it still has the drum brakes. They work ok, I try give more room to cars in front of me and try to use defensive driving tactics all the time. At some point, it’s on my list to be upgraded. The only problem I’ve had so far is when we went to the car show and there was so much eye candy driving around, I lost track for a spit second and almost took out another Mavericks rear end

Completely avoidable and completely my fault...

 

I don't know why people are mentioning other cars with drum brakes to use in their defense of them. We're talking about Mavericks/Comets here, and I drove a Maverick with drum brakes for years. No amount of B.S. is going to change what I know about them, which is that they suck (especially when wet). And no, a "cold disc brake without a splash shield" does not act the same as a wet drum brake. Now I've heard everything.

We're talking about basic safety here, especially on cars that people like to "soup up".
We're not talking about fuel injection, airbags, cupholders, or OnStar GPS.

But hey, so-and-so has been driving on drums for years and "never had a problem", so therefore, drums are just as good as disc.

 

Yep. And folks got by without anti-lock brakes and stability controls as well.

Just need to drive within the vehicles limits to help keep from crashing, is all. Otherwise, everyone driving a smart car.. or Volkswagon bugs.. would be dead in weeks.